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    【ガンダム】ドズル「戦いは数だよ」←これってほんとに正しいの?



    1: 名無し 2022/06/30 12:32:33▼このレスに返信

    戦いは数は正しいのか
    3: 名無し 2022/06/30 12:34:02▼このレスに返信
    正しいよ
    ただ数を揃えるってのは相当大変
    4: 名無し 2022/06/30 12:34:28▼このレスに返信
    それがわかるなら最初からジオンに勝ち目ないですよね?
    5: 名無し 2022/06/30 12:39:03▼このレスに返信
    >4
    だからマトモな戦いになる前にマトモな戦いじゃない方法で終わらせようとしたじゃん
    11: 名無し 2022/06/30 12:49:18▼このレスに返信
    >4
    そのギャップを埋める手段もあったからな
    MSとミノ粉を使用した戦術という
    事実初戦は通用して大勝利だったし
    19: 名無し 2022/06/30 12:52:32▼このレスに返信
    >11
    しかも序盤は核使い放題で火力が段違い
    380: 名無し 2022/06/30 15:55:52▼このレスに返信
    >4
    V作戦からジムが量産されるまでの間にケリをつけるべきという正論だった
    13: 名無し 2022/06/30 12:49:42▼このレスに返信
    例えゲルググでも連携の取れたボール三機には落とされるだろうしな
    18: 名無し 2022/06/30 12:52:19▼このレスに返信

    古代の戦争だと数が少なくても勝利を重ねて攻め滅ぼしちゃってたりはするよね
    33: 名無し 2022/06/30 13:02:59▼このレスに返信
    今回の戦争の話を出すと荒れるかな?
    10倍の数の敵に質で渡り合ってる国がある
    38: 名無し 2022/06/30 13:04:34▼このレスに返信
    >33
    WW2の話?
    日対米とか独対ソとか
    50: 名無し 2022/06/30 13:08:47▼このレスに返信
    >38
    ウクライナ
    54: 名無し 2022/06/30 13:09:28▼このレスに返信
    >50
    ウクライナとロシアの戦力去ってそんなにあったのか・・・
    58: 名無し 2022/06/30 13:11:12▼このレスに返信
    >54
    人口比自体は精々3倍程度だろう
    (そもそもウクライナは旧ソ連圏でも相当に人口豊かな地域)
    戦える奴の数もウクライナ側は正規の軍の規模は劣っても民間人男性皆兵状態だし
    61: 名無し 2022/06/30 13:11:48▼このレスに返信
    >58
    ロシアは兵も少ない海外からの支援もないでよく戦ってるよなあ
    37: 名無し 2022/06/30 13:04:03▼このレスに返信

    わかりやすくせつめいするとこういうこと
    41: 名無し 2022/06/30 13:05:34▼このレスに返信
    >37
    攻撃側と守備側でも話は変わりそうね
    39: 名無し 2022/06/30 13:04:43▼このレスに返信
    開戦前から同じ宇宙移民を犠牲にして敵に回す様なことしてる時点で論外なんで
    48: 名無し 2022/06/30 13:08:09▼このレスに返信
    >39
    敵対するやつは皆殺しにしたからセーフ理論
    51: 名無し 2022/06/30 13:08:59▼このレスに返信
    >48
    敵も減ったが味方も減ったけどな
    44: 名無し 2022/06/30 13:06:15▼このレスに返信
    スレ画の人は開戦前から士官学校の校長やってたりするし軍人としては割と間違った事は言ってない
    172: 名無し 2022/06/30 14:15:01▼このレスに返信
    >44
    シャアの鼻を明かすとか言ってコンスコン派遣したり
    ガルマの仇討と言ってランバラル派遣したりしてるんですよ
    ぶっちゃけドズルってソロモンまではかなり頭おかしい無能士官丸出しの行動を繰り返してるぞ
    218: 名無し 2022/06/30 14:39:11▼このレスに返信
    >172
    視聴者の視点で見りゃ無能にしか見えないってだけでは?
    224: 名無し 2022/06/30 14:45:41▼このレスに返信
    >218
    私的な理由で軍隊を運用(仇討)
    個人的感情で報告を無視
    普通に無能だって
    47: 名無し 2022/06/30 13:07:53▼このレスに返信

    長兄
    55: 名無し 2022/06/30 13:10:07▼このレスに返信
    >47
    やってるやないかい!
    504: 名無し 2022/06/30 18:05:07▼このレスに返信
    >55
    こんな小規模でやるなもっと大規模にやるぞって場面だったと思う
    53: 名無し 2022/06/30 13:09:27▼このレスに返信
    僅か一年間の戦争だからなぁ
    しかも天秤が一気に傾くのはガンダム起動以降の3ヶ月
    57: 名無し 2022/06/30 13:10:21▼このレスに返信
    >53
    たった一隻の母艦と数機のMSで歴史が動いたのか・・・
    62: 名無し 2022/06/30 13:11:51▼このレスに返信
    >57
    実際動いてるからタチが悪い
    ヤバすぎなので戦後幽閉しますね

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      コメント
      1. 1. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 12:14:28 ID:8f406ca37            ★コメ返信★

        ウクライナは市民の6~7割以上が何らかの形で防衛に携わってるからなぁ。
        こいつらを正規軍としてカウントすると兵力としては
        ロシアの侵攻部隊よりも遥かに多いと思う。

      2. 2. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 12:18:23 ID:a551d60d2            ★コメ返信★

        荒れるとか対抗してるとかアホかな?
        ロシアが土地ごと潰す気ならとっくにウクライナは消滅してる

      3. 3. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 12:46:34 ID:b6d6da69d            ★コメ返信★

        ミツバチ「戦いは数だよ!」

        スズメバチも蜂玉で焼き殺します

      4. 4. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 12:49:22 ID:4511dc782            ★コメ返信★

        ※2
        それやると全面核戦争なんすよ

      5. 5. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 12:55:23 ID:5159daf83            ★コメ返信★

        ※2
        あいつらマジでアホだから仕方ない
        東部は親露派でそれをゼレカスが虐殺したのが悪いって言っても全く聞かなかったし
        んで事実が広まったら雲隠れ

      6. 6. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 12:57:11 ID:48e6f05f1            ★コメ返信★

        少数が多数を破った例は歴史上に結構残ってるけど、それは珍しいからこそ残ってるわけだ。
        戦争の基本は相手よりの多数の兵力と物資を必要なだけ、必要な時に投入することだよ。
        理想論だけどこれが基本だよ。

      7. 7. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 13:02:13 ID:193513561            ★コメ返信★

        Gジェネだとボールで囲めばビグザム落とせるからなぁ

      8. 8. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 13:03:27 ID:193513561            ★コメ返信★

        ※3
        なお次蜂スズメバチいきまーす!
        ミツバチは壊滅した

      9. 9. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 13:08:39 ID:a551d60d2            ★コメ返信★

        戦力三倍差あったら奇策をもってしても勝てないって中国四大名将の李牧も言ってるぞ

      10. 10. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 13:16:33 ID:42aef8124            ★コメ返信★

        数が有れば基本的に有利ではあるが、相手に大量破壊兵器が有れば無意味だからな

      11. 11. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 13:20:39 ID:4278a163c            ★コメ返信★

        ※5
        そりゃ根拠のねえボケ老人の戯言じゃな

      12. 12. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 13:28:10 ID:6c4d7f661            ★コメ返信★

        ※6
        それこそ織田信長vs今川義元の桶狭間くらいかね

      13. 13. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 13:30:08 ID:0f7a45554            ★コメ返信★

        ※5
        イベルメクチン飲んでそう

      14. 14. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 13:37:19 ID:dfd61c628            ★コメ返信★

        >記事1
        数がいなければ部隊を分けることもできない。
        部隊を分けることができなければできる作戦の幅も狭くなる。
        できる作戦の幅が狭いと変化する状況に柔軟に対応することが出来ない。

        まあ少ないよりは多い方が良いよね

      15. 15. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 13:44:39 ID:478e2fec3            ★コメ返信★

        ※8
        ミツバチの巣一か所に来るスズメバチはせいぜい数匹だから全滅はスズメバチ攻撃隊の方
        数千~数万のミツバチは全部喰いきれないから全滅しないよ
        結局戦いは同時に投入出来る戦力の数だな

      16. 16. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 13:45:17 ID:dfd61c628            ★コメ返信★

        >記事33
        そりゃあ他国からの武器弾薬等々の物資支援がガンガン来ていれば戦闘継続なんてできるに決まってる。
        ただ防衛までは何とかなってもロシア軍への攻勢は上手くいってないのが現状。

      17. 17. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 13:47:40 ID:a31286205            ★コメ返信★

        >記事58
        人口比でいえば2倍程度だった太平洋戦争時の日米の戦力差は…

      18. 18. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 13:53:51 ID:478e2fec3            ★コメ返信★

        >記事172
        WB隊は連邦とジオン両方にとってプロパガンダの効果があるし現実にもジオンのエースをかなり潰されてるから、これを叩くのは軍事的に意味があるしドズルの頭はまともだな
        シャアの鼻とかガルマの仇はまっとうな作戦に個人的な感情を乗せてるだけ

      19. 19. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 13:58:45 ID:48e6f05f1            ★コメ返信★

        ※12
        桶狭間だって義元の本陣が手薄になったってことは結果論とはいえ必要な兵力をちゃんと配置できなかったってことだからな。
        そのための情報収集を怠ってはいけないって話になるわけだ

      20. 20. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 14:22:31 ID:93f2e45fe            ★コメ返信★

        ※12
        信長の弾正織田家は尾張統一前ですら近隣国で並ぶものおらん超強豪で、動員兵数は実質3国持ってる今川とほぼ互角。当時弾正織田家の中でも派閥争いで分裂してるとはいえ、それでも
        対する今川は短期間の2度のお家騒動でまともな譜代がおらず動員もかなり減ってる状態。
        沓掛と丸根で勝利したとはいえ、信長が動いて前哨戦がはじまると今川は品野城守れたくらいで他は物量で情報遮断や補給路遮断やられてボロボロだからな。
        正面からの決戦でも、今川が有利ってわけでもないのだ。

      21. 21. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 15:56:10 ID:8beb82028            ★コメ返信★

        ※6
        背水の陣とかもそうよね。
        たまたま勝ったパターンがあるってだけで基本は敗ける戦法。

      22. 22. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 16:24:30 ID:5606fbb31            ★コメ返信★

        IQ300「ビグ・ザムいれば余裕やんw」

        ⬆こいつほんとにIQ300か?

      23. 23. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 17:36:54 ID:122e69984            ★コメ返信★

        ※12
        第二次世界大戦初戦のドイツや日本

      24. 24. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 18:18:12 ID:05d5a2ff2            ★コメ返信★

        ※15
        けど実際には数匹のスズメバチによって、巣箱一個分くらい殲滅されたりしてるんやで
        別段、倒したミツバチは全部喰わなきゃならないわけでもないし、戦力比でいえばスズメバチ一匹で数十から数百は倒すくらい差があるうえで、二・三匹が巣箱の入り口付近で半封鎖状態でミツバチ狩ってくからな
        ゆえに効率はさらに上がって、一・二匹のスズメバチで千匹くらいは相手できるっていう

        それに何より、蜂玉やるのは日本ミツバチで、養蜂においては主流になってんのは西洋ミツバチなんで、対抗策はほとんどないという養蜂家の絶望
        まぁスズメバチからしても巣箱殲滅するのは大変なんで、ある程度やったら撤退するそうだけど、ほっとけば再来するから結局は状況放置すればミツバチやられるってさ

      25. 25. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 19:51:01 ID:fe2c5e27d            ★コメ返信★

        まずMSなんかよりコロニー落としとサイド1.2.4.5を核で滅ぼしといて南極条約結んでんのが連邦を舐め過ぎた
        核と質量兵器に頼らなきゃ勝てないと悟っておきながら相手が使わないならMSで勝てると驕ったのが敗因
        統治が目的の戦争で占領地を統治出来ないとか話にならん、それも唯一上手く行ってたのがガルマしかいないとか尚更

      26. 26. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 19:51:29 ID:033b85989            ★コメ返信★

        ※23
        それ実はイメージだけの話で太平洋戦争序盤はむしろ日本側が数的有利よ
        数が逆転して米軍多数になるのは1944年初頭あたりから、イメージ通りの圧倒的多数になるのは44年末ごろ
        まあ米軍は数的劣勢背負ってんのにわずか半年で日本の進攻止めて、新戦力の就役を待たずそのまま反攻できてるから少数で多数を破ったという意味では正しいのか

      27. 27. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/01(Fri) 23:20:35 ID:12b736b56            ★コメ返信★

        継戦能力と実働実数があれば制圧は無理でも人命無視の壊滅打撃は与えられるからな

      28. 28. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/02(Sat) 18:07:22 ID:834a6b871            ★コメ返信★

        三段打ちで勝利したみたいに語られている長篠の戦いとか、画期的な新戦術なんて出る幕のない手堅い合戦でしかないしな

      29. 29. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/04(Mon) 12:01:31 ID:266cd0a64            ★コメ返信★

        ウクライナも数の理論でロシアに対抗してるだけなのにそれを理解してない人がいるのかな
        どれだけの国がウクライナを支援してると思ってるのだか
        それとも前線で戦う兵士の数しか見てないのかな

      30. 30. 名前:匿名 投稿日:2022/07/04(Mon) 12:16:28 ID:266cd0a64            ★コメ返信★

        ※9
        奇策を使えなくしたうえで3倍で囲めば、だぞ
        ぶっちゃけ戦いにならないようにすれば勝てる
        それが戦の基本

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        ※21
        背水の陣は破れかぶれの作戦ではなく必勝の戦法
        川の手前に陣をひき敵主力をおびき寄せ
        別動隊を敵の本陣に送り込む

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